From emaxon AT megsinet.net Wed Dec  9 09:49:54 1998
Date: Wed, 03 Dec 1997 14:07:04 -0600
From: Eric Maxon 
To: Andrew Finney 
Cc: quattro-digest AT coimbra.ans.net, phen9461 AT uidaho.edu
Subject: Re: 4000 series / UrQ tie rod removal - question.

Andrew Finney wrote:

> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>  Anyhow, just venting.  I looked in EC's article on the 4kq
> front
> suspension rebuilt.  FOr the Tie-Rod replacement they say,
> "remove two
> inner bolts and then remove tie-rods" or something like that.
> ANyone else
> have similar problems.
>
>  Todd Phenneger   aka: Zarati
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>
> I'm about to replace the tie rods on my UrQ and I remembered
> doing the job on my old '82 coupe. Can anyone answer the
> question: Do you have to remove the tie rod carrier bracket
> from the steering rack before removing the tie rods from the
> bracket? I seem to remember that there isn't enough clearance
> to remove the tie rod bolts as they hit the steering rack
> bellows. Anyone have any suggestions.
>
> Andrew Finney
> 1983 UrQ.

Yes, absolutely-- you must remove the bracket from the rack to remove
the inner tie rod ends from the bracket.  The "bolts" that hold the tie
rods to the bracket are actually splined studs pressed into a small
plate that sits between the inner tie rod ends and the body of the
rack-- there is not enough clearance to push the plate back far enough
to dislodge the studs from the inner tie rod ends.  ***Don't lose and
don't forget to properly reinstall the NUTS on the bottom of the two
bolts that hold the bracket to the rack.  (It is possible to remove the
bolts without even noticing the nuts are there-- they'll fall onto the
top of the transmission when you remove the bolts.)  Torque the bolts to
33ftlbs, then install the nuts and torque them to 33ftlbs.  Don't even
think of trying to remove the outer tie rod ends without removing the
whole tie rod and clamping it in a vise-- you'll never be able to do
it.  It sounds like you've got whole new tie rods-- that's good.  The
adjsuting studs often break when trying to remove the outer ends, and
are generally not available as separate parts.  You'll save yourself
worlds of hassle replacing the tie rods as complete assemblies.

good luck.  (this job's not much fun, and you'll be LUCKY if you can
preserve your toe in setting.)

Eric.



From HAREST AT allenbrook.iix.com Wed Dec  9 09:49:58 1998
Date: Wed, 03 Dec 1997 09:39:32 -0500
From: "Hare,Stott (X)" 
To: Todd Phenneger 
Cc: quattro list 
Subject: removing 4kq tie rods

Unfortunately there was a step that was missed.  To remove either tie
rod assembly, you must first
remove the bracket the tie rod bolt to from the rack.  Simple? No.  The
rack is threaded, and the
two bolt securing the bracket to the rack have nuts on the underside...
So remove the nuts from below,
can't just hold the nut and spin the bolt 'cause the rack is threaded.
Then remove the bolts.  Now you can get the clearance you need to remove
the double bolt/stud & plate assembly holding the tie rods to the
bracket.
  Fun huh??  Oh yeah,  installation is reverse of removal.

-S

Stott Hare
Application Developer
Policy Administration Team

harest AT allenbrook.iix.com

> -----Original Message-----
> From:	Todd Phenneger [SMTP:phen9461 AT uidaho.edu]
> Sent:	Tuesday, December 02, 1997 9:36 PM
> To:	Hare,Stott (X); Quattro List
> Subject:	4kq breakdowns and adventures. (Longish)
> 
> 
> AARRGHH,
> <<< SNIP >>>
>          ANyhow, on Sunday I go to the car, easy fix.  Wrong.  Strut
> goes
> in fine, 20 minute job, no more.  Passenger side Tie-rod wont come
> out.
> It's raining.  I'm tired.  I watn to be home.  3 hours later, I still
> cant
> get the inner bolt out.  It seems to want to run right into the
> Steering
> rack Rod.  I rip the boot on my rack.  I cant get the 2 bolts that
> hold
> the racks rod to the tie-rod mounting bracket out.  I try a hammper,
> pliers, a torch.  Nothing.  Finally it comes out.  I replace the rod,
> cant
> get it back in so I GRIND IT DOWN ON A GRINDER, now it slides by.  I
> put
> it all back together.  Humm, Lets see, besides the car breaking, it
> just
> took me 5 hours to replace 1 tie-rod.  The driver side was cake.  Why
> the
> pain.  
>         Anyhow, just venting.  I looked in EC's article on the 4kq
> front
> suspension rebuilt.  FOr the Tie-Rod replacement they say, "remove two
> inner bolts and then remove tie-rods" or something like that.  ANyone
> else
> have similar problems.  Now I DEFINATELY want to remove the battery
> and
> stick it in the trunk.  Oh, and how should I get those other two bolts
> off
> so I can replace my torn boot?
>         Other than that, had a good break.   OH, AND MY CAR HANDLES
> MUCH
> BETTER NOW WITH NEW TIE-RODS.  Whole front Susp in new now.  Love it.
> 
>         Todd Phenneger   aka: Zarati
>         1984 4000s quattro / New Red Paint
>         2.5" Borla SS Exhaust  /  Boge Turbo Gas Shocks
>         15" Wheels & 205/50 ZR15 Bridgestone RE-71s
>         Considering a Turbo Conversion  :)
> 

From quattro AT rogerswave.ca Wed Dec  9 09:50:01 1998
Date: Wed, 3 Dec 1997 12:03:28 +0000
From: Martin Pajak 
To: quattro AT coimbra.ans.net
Subject: Re: removing 4kq tie rods

> Unfortunately there was a step that was missed.  To remove either tie
> rod assembly, you must first
> remove the bracket the tie rod bolt to from the rack.  Simple? No.  The
> rack is threaded, and the
> two bolt securing the bracket to the rack have nuts on the underside...
> So remove the nuts from below,
> can't just hold the nut and spin the bolt 'cause the rack is threaded.
> Then remove the bolts.  Now you can get the clearance you need to remove
> the double bolt/stud & plate assembly holding the tie rods to the
> bracket.
>   Fun huh??  Oh yeah,  installation is reverse of removal.
> 
This is one of the reasons the first thing I did on my quattros is to 
move the battery to the trunk.  Passanger side drive shafts. tie rods 
are much more accessable not to mension the center diff lock 
actuator on the later cars.  How do you get at that thing with the 
battery tray in the way anyways?

Later.

Martin Pajak
quattro AT rogerswave.ca
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/5939

1982 Coupe TURBO (473,150 km)
1984 4000s quattro (soon to be a rally car)
1986 4000s quattro (300,000 km)
1970 Porsche 911E Targa (for sale)


From phen9461 AT uidaho.edu Wed Dec  9 09:50:19 1998
Date: Wed, 3 Dec 1997 15:23:06 -0800 (PST)
From: Todd Phenneger 
To: "Hare,Stott (X)" 
Cc: quattro list 
Subject: Re: removing 4kq tie rods

OK, OK,
	I saw those two bolts.  Tried removing them.  Got the bottom nuts
off with no problem but the bolts would only turn about one full turn and
then sieze.  Dang.  I need to get them off one of these days so I can
replace the boot for the rack piston rod.  BTW, what is the danger of
driving without this boot on.  Just messy from a little oil getting on
stuff when you work around there or does it really need to be replaced to
dave my steering from failing?
	ANyhow, I am scared to put to much force on those bolts for fear
of breaking them.  ANy suggestions anyone.
	Oh, BTW, I did replace the Entire TIe-rods without removing the
bracket from the rack, but it did take 5 hours.  ANd I had to grind the
bolt head down to get it back on so they would clear.  I'm sure removing
the bracket is easyer but it IS possable without doing so.  Would NOT
recomend it though.  I am patient but I probable would of traded my car
for a YUGO just to get home at that point.  L8R

	Todd Phenneger   aka: Zarati
	1984 4000s quattro / New Red Paint
	2.5" Borla SS Exhaust  /  Boge Turbo Gas Shocks
	15" Wheels & 205/50 ZR15 Bridgestone RE-71s
	Considering a Turbo Conversion  :)

On Wed, 3 Dec 1997, Hare,Stott (X) wrote:

> Unfortunately there was a step that was missed.  To remove either tie
> rod assembly, you must first
> remove the bracket the tie rod bolt to from the rack.  Simple? No.  The
> rack is threaded, and the
> two bolt securing the bracket to the rack have nuts on the underside...
> So remove the nuts from below,
> can't just hold the nut and spin the bolt 'cause the rack is threaded.
> Then remove the bolts.  Now you can get the clearance you need to remove
> the double bolt/stud & plate assembly holding the tie rods to the
> bracket.
>   Fun huh??  Oh yeah,  installation is reverse of removal.
> 
> -S
> 
> Stott Hare
> Application Developer
> Policy Administration Team
> 
> harest AT allenbrook.iix.com